Recently in FAQ's Category

April 17, 2014

ATF eForms back online within the week

Today Marvin G. Richardson, Deputy Assistant Director of the ATF Enforcement Programs and Services sent a letter stating that ATF eForms is expected online this week.

  • The ATF has reduced the backlog of applications from 80,000 to 73,000.
  • Adding 15 additional staff to help process NFA applications
  • Cross training an additional 15 staff to assist in NFA processing
  • Prioritizing Form 3 and Form 4 paper application processing while eForms is being bolstered
  • Hired a private company to assist in enhancing the functionality of eForms
  • Will limit maintenance to Wednesdays
  • Will bring eForms back online for Form 6 and 6A.
  • Will allow Forms 1,2,5,9,5300.11 and 10 online over the next few weeks
  • Allow Form 4 and Form 1 processing in a new and improved eForms in the short-term
In the letter he states that electronic submission saves over 3 month in processing time, but I have personally seen that it can save a year in some cases. He further states that NFA applications re up over 380 percent in the last few years from 41,600 in 2005 to 199,900 in 2013. Many of these new applications have been because of new laws in many states legalizing suppressors and short barrel riffles. Gun Trusts have made these items available to many who live in areas where the CLEO will not sign a Form 4 or Form 1. To find out more about how a Gun Trust can help you protect your family and friends from violations of Gun Laws contact us.

This is good news and it looks like ATF is interested in maintaining eForms into the future.

April 17, 2014

Status Update on 41P

The Americans Opposed to ATF 41P reported today that the American Silencer Association has talks with the ATF during the Shot Show where the ATF stated that they never anticipated the number of comments to 41P that they received and only had one person working part-time on addressing the comments. At that time ATF anticipated that it would take a year or two before they were able to determine whether they were going to move forward and if so to what extent they would try to implement any changes.
There were several major comments to 41P including ours that can be reviewed at htttp://www.GunTrustLawyer.com/41p.html which should be able to challenge the ATF if the ATF should try to implement the changes because of the numerous violations of the Administrative Procedures Act.

So what does this mean?
We are still recommending purchasing what you think you may way sooner rather than later in case changes are made. While a challenge to the changes may be successful, there is no guarantee that it would be. The good news is that the June 1st date that everyone has been anticipating may come and go with no announcement or just a new self imposed deadline. On the other hand, the ATF may have devoted more resources since the SHOT show and may try to make an announcement in June. We are about 6 weeks away from knowing more and as we find out more or see others reporting on this issue we will keep you updated. We have been hearing that there has been a substantial increase in the number of NFA firearms that are being sold and supplies within the dealers are starting to become constrained. With the ATF removing access to the electronic filing of ATF forms, the time to replenish the supply, get permission to manufacture more, and time to obtain approval of Form 4s and Form 1s will probably increase. There is a chance that the ATF will resolve the issues with the electronic filing and this could create an opportunity for a faster processing time. To check on the status of the ATF eForms portal visit https://www.atfonline.gov/EForms/.

April 6, 2014

ATF takes down eForms "until further notice"

eforms_logo.jpgIf you were planning on submitting a form electronically to save time, you may not be able to use eForms. I logged onto the ATF eForms website yesterday and saw the following message:

The eForms software is not performing to our expectations. As a result, we are taking the eForms system down until further notice. We apologize for any inconvenience and appreciate your patience as we work with our industry partners to deliver a quality product. Any eForm submitted will continue to be processed. The finalized forms will be sent to the user via email.

Until the eForms system is returned to service for the industry, all imports forms (Forms 6 Part I and 6A), NFA forms (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 9 and 10), and AFMER reports (Form 5300.11) must be submitted via paper, including any eForms in draft status.

Copy of submitted or finalized eForm
Direct a request to eForms.Request@atf.gov
Status queries
Contact the NFA Branch at (304) 616-4550
Contact the Firearms and Explosives Imports Branch at (304) 616-4550
Other eForms questions
Direct the question to eForms.admin@atf.gov

April 6, 2014

ATF Says it is OK to fire SB-15 Pistol from the Shoulder

sig_arm_brace_sb15.jpgIn a response to a recent letter the the ATF, the ATF stated:

FTB has previously determined (see FTB #99146) that the firing of a weapon from a particular position, such as placing the receiver extension of an AR-15 type pistol on the user's shoulder, does not change the classification of a weapon. Further, certain firearm accessories such as the SIG stability brace have not been classified by the FTB as shoulder stocks and, therefore, using the brace improperly does not constitute a design change. Using an accessory improperly would not change the classification of a weapon under Federal law. However, the FTB cannot recommend using a weapon (or weapon accessory) in a manner not intended by the manufacturer.

The Letter that Sig sends with the SB-15 states that it is ok to use the brace as intended and does not create a firearm subject to the NFA. Previously this left many concerned that if someone was to use the brace not as intended an SBR would be created. This letter from the ATF clears up the issue and states that just because an accessory was not used as intended, the firearms is not reclassified by ATF.

If you would like a copy of the letter from the ATF for your records it can be downloaded.

March 10, 2014

Straw Purchases and Gun Trusts

In the last 3 weeks we have received more calls about arrests or seizures involving the ATF and straw purchases than in the previous 7 years. (NOTE: none of these calls were from people using our gun trusts) We felt it important for individuals and those involved with Gun Trusts to understand the concept and how to make sure they are not involved in a straw purchase.
If you are in Florida and have been arrested for a straw purchase or have had firearms seized regarding a straw purchase, contact an attorney who is familiar with straw purchases and firearms. If you are in another state you should look for someone who deals with criminal law and is familiar with firearms. This type of representation can be a very expensive as it is typically a federal charge and most criminal lawyers do not practice in the federal courts.

A straw purchase is any purchase wherein an agent agrees to acquire a good or service for someone who is able or unable or unwilling to purchase the good or service himself, and the agent transfers the goods/services to that person after purchasing them.

Several sources incorrectly state that "Straw purchases are legal except in cases where the ultimate receiver of goods or services uses those goods or services in the commission of a crime with the prior knowledge of the straw purchaser, or if the ultimate possessor is not legally able to purchase the goods/services." While the above statement may be correct in some cases, it is not correct when dealing with firearms.

If the straw purchaser of the firearm lies about the identity of the ultimate possessor of the gun, he or she can be charged with making false statements on a Federal Firearms Transaction Record. If a firearm is purchased as a gift, the transaction is not a straw purchase, and the person buying the gift is considered the end user.

There is currently a supreme court case on this topic where a family member bought a gun for a relative so that he could get a "police discount" and then was arrested for making a straw purchase because he lied on the 4473 where he stated that he was the intended purchaser. Both parties were legally able to purchase the item and neither was a prohibited person.

If you have a gun trust you should be very careful not to do straw purchases where the trust purchases something for someone not associated with the trust or a person associated with your gun trust purchased items for someone else. We generally see people make mistakes when transactions across state lines are involved or someone is under the age of 21 wants to purchase an NFA firearm. The instructions which came with your gun trust should cover these issues. It is important that you not add someone on to your trust only for the purpose of buying a gun or NFA firearms that you could not otherwise purchase.

February 13, 2014

ATF Forms Processing Time

Today the ATF released new processing times based upon December 2013. The are now reporting the the average times for processing an ATF Form 1 to make and register a firearms is 9 months and the average time on an ATF Form 4 to transfer and register a NFA firearm in 9 months. We have seen significantly reduced times when applying electronically. Below are the times for each type of transfer and or application as reported by the ATF. It is interesting to see that they are taking 3 months to approve / process a transfer on a Form 3 and 2 months on a form 2. That means, it is taking ATF 2 months to approve the manufacture and 3 months to approve the transfer to a dealer. More than 5 months are required just to make and send a suppressor to your dealer so that you can wait an additional 9 months to take it home. The ATF will update this information every 90 days so we can see the trend.

As more people file electronically, we could start to experience longer wait times but for now we are hearing that many electronic Form 4s and Form 1s are taking between 3-6 months instead of 9-12 months for the traditional forms.
ATF times1.jpg
ATF times2.jpg

February 9, 2014

I think I want a Gun Trust for Title II firearms only.

While many people think they only want a Gun Trust to purchase NFA firearms, there are many reasons you should consider putting all of your firearms in a properly drafted Gun Trust.

Just this week, I wrote that NOLO had reported that you should not use their software to create a Gun Trust. This is something that we have been talking about for over 5 years and it was nice to see them realize the problems that could be created by the use of a traditional revocable trust.

A Gun Trust should be designed to hold all firearms including those restricted by the NFA. All of our Gun Trusts are designed for all of your firearms including Title II firearms (those regulated by the NFA).

You will find that owners of NFA firearms own other guns. The normal guns like a pistol and shotgun are called Title I firearms. As an owner of all types of guns, I designed our Gun Trust to deal with common issues gun owners face with pistols, revolvers, and hunting riffles as well as Title II firearms.

What most people do not realize regular firearms have many of the same issues regarding transfer upon death or incapacity that exist with NFA guns. It is for this reason that I would suggest putting all of your Guns in one a Gun Trust.

The real issue is that while we can pick beneficiaries while we are alive, we do not know who will survive us. Those that do survive may not be appropriate to receive the firearms upon our death.

We do not know where they will live. Many states restrict the purchase, transfer, or ownership of certain firearms regardless of how they are received. We do not know if the firearms we own will be legal where our beneficiaries will be living when we die. In addition, some states require special permits to be in possession or own some or all types of firearms. While some states give you a grace period to acquire the proper permits, other states do not.

Have our kids or friends done something silly that we do not know about that might have caused the beneficiaries to lose their rights to own, possess, or use a gun. Are they involved with drugs in a state where it is legal? While drug use may be legal in some states, it is still a federal crime and makes the person using illegal drugs a prohibited person.

Another issue might involve being charged with an act of domestic violence or child abuse even if not ultimately convicted of that charge. The Lautenberg Amendment is a federal statute that says that charges that are classified as domestic violence or child abuse can create a permanent loss of your firearms rights.

Most importantly, as much as we would like to believe that our beneficiaries will be the right age and have the right mental state when we die, we will not be there to make the decision. Our Gun Trust takes all of this into consideration and allows the Successor Trustee of the Gun Trust to look at the location of the beneficiary, the legal status of the beneficiary, as well as the age and maturity and responsibility of the beneficiary to make a proper decision on the disposition of the firearms.

Other trusts or so called gun trusts only require that someone is not determined to be legally incompetent and or reach a certain age. When it comes to guns, a traditional trust without good Gun Trust provisions or created without the help of a Gun Trust Lawyer® can create criminal liability for your family and friends to transfer and receive firearms. Remember that people change over time, and it is not always for the better.

The good news is that if you already have a trust that holds firearms, it can be usually be changed to properly deal with them. If you would like to find out more about creating a Gun Trust or changing your existing trust to properly deal with firearms and purchase NFA firearms contact a Gun Trust Lawyer®.

January 11, 2014

Can I form a Gun Trust if I am 18, 19, or 20?

We often get questions from people who are 18 and want to know if they can form a Gun Trust?

The good news is that you can form a gun trust at the age of 18 with a Gun Trust Lawyer®. If you are going to purchase NFA firearms or pistols, you must be at least 21 years to purchase from a dealer. If you purchase NFA firearm from an individual you only need to be 18.

You only need to be 18 to be in possession of a NFA Firearm and other trustees who are on your trust who are over the age of 21 may purchase NFA firearms on behalf of the trust.

You need to be careful about the straw purchase requirements which would prohibit adding someone who is over 21 only to purchase the firearms. You can add someone for other reasons who is over 21 like a parent or sibling that you go shooting with and once they are a co-trustee or trustee on your gun trust, they can make purchases that you might not be able to make as an 18 - 20-year-old.

If you need help structuring a gun trust to meet your desired goals and deal with your specific circumstances, call us or use the contact us form on the right and we will send you information on forming a gun trust with one of the more than 200 Gun Trust Lawyers® we work with around the US.

December 23, 2013

Do I need a Gun Trust to buy a Suppressor, if I already have a revocable trust?

We often get questions from people about using a regular trust or existing trust that they already have to purchase a suppressor. First a trust or Gun Trust is not required to purchase a suppressor. A suppressor is a Title II firearm, that is sold by a Class III FFL. It can be purchased by an individual, trust, or business entity. Currently, an individuals must obtain a CLEO signature as well as provide fingerprints with the application to purchase a suppressor. Any purchase from an individual, trust, Gun Trust, or business entity must pay a $200 tax stamp and complete an ATF Form 4.

That being said, a Trust or Gun Trust has many other benefits besides the CLEO and fingerprint submission.

  1. A Gun Trust may submit an application electronically and between 2-6 months in processing.
  2. The ability to tell your representatives how to properly transfer these firearms upon your death.
  3. The ability to transfer assets to children, even below the age of 18, when they reach an appropriate age while giving the someone the ability to make distribution decisions based on mental state, physical location, legality of the transfer, and age.
  4. The ability for the Trustee to refuse assets transferred by will or other means if NFA and state requirements are not complied with.
  5. Requirement to comply with NFA and State laws for transfer of NFA related assets.
  6. The ability to make uneven distributions to heirs to conserve value of assets.
  7. The ability to purchase Title II firearms, without creating a violation of the duties of the trustee.
  8. The ability to use the firearms in the trust without creating liability to the beneficiaries.
  9. The instructions and formalities on how to: manufacture items under a Form 1, how to purchase items correctly under a Form 4, how to properly document and transport Title II firearms with a Form 20.
  10. Protection for yourself and your family from Constructive Possession - a violation of the NFA.
  11. The ability to add others to your trust at a later time and create additional authorized users of the firearms.

Some Gun Trusts can even be designed to include:

  1. The ability to have Trustees with different capabilities.
  2. The ability to protect the firearms from your creditors and the creditors of your beneficiaries.
  3. The ability to hold the firearms for multiple generations and in some cases forever.
  4. The ability to modify the terms of the trust to attempt to preserve privacy, ownership, avoid future transfers and loss of firearms due to future legislation.
  5. The ability to easily add users, remove users, change beneficiaries and create temporary users of the firearms.
  6. The your representatives how to properly transfer these firearms upon your death.

So while a regular revocable trust could be used to purchase NFA firearms, a regular trust is designed for financial assets and would often instruct those who survive you to dispose of the firearms in ways that could create legal issues for your family and friends. In addition, the firearms could be sold off to pay your bills or funeral expenses instead of using other cash or assets that may be available.

A Gun Trust is a very specific type of trust that is designed for NFA and non NFA firearms. Before hiring someone to create a Gun Trust or purchasing a NFA Gun Trust, you should check to understand what you are getting because not all gun trusts are the same. Many so called "Gun Trusts" or "NFA Trusts" are regular revocable trusts that are designed for bank account and land and have little to do with firearms.

If you have a trust that you would like reviewed for issues dealing with the NFA, we would be happy to do so at no charge. We will not be reviewing the state issues but federal issues.

October 18, 2013

Gun Trust Lawyer®, David Goldman Comments to ATF 41P

While many people will be waiting to the last-minute to file their comments to 41P, we felt that it was important to file something sooner to provide our clients and readers some guidance on preparing comments. We have created a webpage which contains our comments, exhibits, as well as a copy of 41P as published in the registry. As the comments and exhibits are over 140 pages we have included an index to the comments to help you find the information in which you have the most interst.

While we are very familiar with the NFA and ATF, administrative rule making is not something that we deal with. It is for this reason and to make sure we preserve the right to appeal any outcome that we have hired Tom Odom at the Firearms Industry Consulting Group. They are one of the fine lawyers that we work with around the country. If you are looking to have a professionally written response tailored to your involvement or objectives, I would highly recommend contacting us or them and we would be happy to help with the process.

With the exception of ATF's proposal to add new section 479.90 with respect to decedents' estates, David M. Goldman opposes the remainder of the proposed rule making for the reasons set forth below and in the Exhibits to these Comments incorporated herein by reference.


  • Part I, below, demonstrates that ATF failed to identify any problem for its proposed rule to correct. ATF neither quantified any benefits from its proposed rule (pages 2-5), likely because the proposal predominantly addresses conduct that is already criminalized, nor identified a single example that illustrates the problem that it speculates may exist (pages 5-13). Indeed, there is scant evidence of misuse of registered NFA firearms (pages 13-14).

  • Part II illustrates that trusts serve many legitimate purposes (pages 14-21), establish distinct roles with very different powers with respect to trust assets (pages 21-26), and arise in varied contexts, some of which should ameliorate concerns regarding potential misuse (pages 26-29), but that ATF has not considered these distinctions in formulating its proposed rule. Some trusts specifically designed to hold NFA firearms have numerous safeguards against improper transfer of trust assets that may be more effective than anything ATF proposes yet ATF failed to acknowledge such provisions or explain why some combination of them would be inadequate (pages 29-32).

  • Part III explains how the CLEO certification requirement renders the proposed rule unworkable and demonstrates the need to abandon the certification for individuals as well as legal entities (pages 33-41).

  • Part IV documents ATF's underestimate of the cost of its proposed rule due to understated costs (pages 42-45) as well as omitting altogether lost tax revenue (pages 45-46) and the cost of hearing loss attributable to the greater unavailability of silencers (pages 46-48).

  • Part V details the many less-intrusive alternatives that ATF failed to consider in formulating its proposed rule (pages 48-54), including a more-limited concept of responsible persons and use of modern methods of conducting background checks.


In addition, there are 90 pages of exhibits. If you are looking to review the materials or provide them to others to review, I would ask that you link to this article or the 41P page which is located at http://www.GunTrustLawyer.com/41p.html on our website so that the latest version will be available to those who look. As ATF is not doing anything with comments because of the shutdown, we may hold off on filing our response, but wanted to let others review, comment and use it to help in their responses.

October 17, 2013

What States are Silencers Legal in?

We are often asked are silencers legal in my state? While you can look at which NFA firearms are legal in each state by selecting it in the pull down menu on the right, we have put together this list to make it easy for you to know if they are legal in your state.

Silencers are legal in

AL, AK, AZ, AR, CO, CT, FL, GA, ID, IN, KS, KY, LA, ME, MD, MI, MS, MO, MT, NE, NV, NH, NM, NC, ND, OH, OK, OR, PA, SC, SD, TN, TX, UT, VA, WA, WV, WI, AND WY

Silencers are not legal in the following 10 States.
California, Hawaii, Illinois, Iowa, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, Vermont.

While individuals may not possess suppressors in NY and HI Police officers may have them in certain circumstances

You cannot buy a silencer or bring a silencer to a state where they are illegal, but Silencers can be purchased by residents of states where they are legal. Often authorized users of Gun Trusts are located in different states and while a resident of California cannot purchase a silencer, a Co-Trustee who is a resident of a state where they are legal like Arizona or Nevada can purchase a silencer that is kept in a state where silencers are legal.

If you would like more information on how a Gun Trust Lawyer® can help you protect your rights and own Title II firearms with the use of a Gun Trust Contact Us.

October 3, 2013

How to Fill Out an ATF Form 5 (5320.5) for Tax Free Transfers

We just posted a page http://www.guntrustlawyer.com/form5.html on completing an ATF Form 5 (5320.5). Remember a Form 5 is used for a tax-free transfer to a lawful heir. If you own NFA firearms individually, you can give your lawful heir the choice of taking the item individually, in trust, or as permitted by the ATF under the NFA and creating properly drafted documents can help make this process unnecessary or easier than using the default methods found in most wills and estate planning documents that are not drafted to consider firearms.

Additionally you can avoid this entire process with a multi generational asset protection gun trust. We have Gun Trusts that can be setup to last form generation to generation without future transfers or the tax stamp fees.

We also have pages on
How to complete an ATF Form 1 (5320.1)
How to complete an ATF Form 4 (5320.4)
The Certification that should be included with each
and How to complete an ATF Form 20 (5330.20)

To learn more about how to update your documents contact a Gun Trust Lawyer® by using the form at the top right of this page.

August 29, 2013

Whitehouse.gov posts inaccurate fact sheet on Trusts

Below is what was posted on the whitehouse.gov website. It is clear that the whoever wrote this does not understand the law and you will notice a lot of anti firearms language and an anti gun rights slant to the message.

Closing a Loophole to Keep Some of the Most Dangerous Guns Out of the Wrong Hands

  • Current law places special restrictions on many of the most dangerous weapons, such as machine guns and short-barreled shotguns. These weapons must be registered, and in order to lawfully possess them, a prospective buyer must undergo a fingerprint-based background check.

  • However, felons, domestic abusers, and others prohibited from having guns can easily evade the required background check and gain access to machine guns or other particularly dangerous weapons by registering the weapon to a trust or corporation. At present, when the weapon is registered to a trust or corporation, no background check is run. ATF reports that last year alone, it received more than 39,000 requests for transfers of these restricted firearms to trusts or corporations.

  • Today, ATF is issuing a new proposed regulation to close this loophole. The proposed rule requires individuals associated with trusts or corporations that acquire these types of weapons to undergo background checks, just as these individuals would if the weapons were registered to them individually. By closing this loophole, the regulation will ensure that machine guns and other particularly dangerous weapons do not end up in the wrong hands.

First I will address what was posted.

  1. The NFA imposes a restriction on the transfer and possession of certain firearms. Not all prospective buyers must undergo a fingerprint-based background check.
  2. Most people using Gun Trusts are purchasing suppressors, these are not dangerous weapons, in fact a suppressor is not a weapon unless you hit someone with it. Most suppressors are round and do not have a sharp edge. A butter knife is more of a weapon than a suppressor
  3. Next, prohibited persons and felons cannot easily evade the requirement of a background check to gain access to machine guns anymore than they can with a regular firearm. Most dealers will do a NICS check on anyone purchasing a Machine Gun. As far as transfers from non firearms dealers, there are stricter requirements on transfers to individuals and the same requirements as regular firearms to trusts or corporations. No criminal would subject themselves to notifying the ATF of their intent to purchase a machine gun, wait 6-12 month to be able to receive the firearm, pay a $200 tax, and pay an extra $10,000 - $20,000 to purchase a legal machine gun when illegal machine guns can be purchased or made easily without waiting or notifying the ATF. This logic is flawed.
  4. There is a process where the ATF can change the rules and requirements in the procedure for purchasing these items. This is not a done deal and as of now what might be proposed is unknown but it will likely include something similar to a NICS check or fingerprint cards.

So what does this mean for your current Gun Trust or one you are ready to create?

This does not mean Gun Trusts are dead or useless. NO. In fact, today many people who only own regular firearms use Gun Trust to manage their firearms. It is the responsible way to own firearms to prevent your family and friends from being subjected to an accidental felony.

Current estate planning and state laws are flawed when it comes to the disposition of firearms to those who survive you. They treat a firearm the same as a bank account. Firearms owners are generally very responsible people and would not want to put their family or friends at risk because of their death.

Our Gun Trusts deal with these issues and allow those who survive you to make smart and intelligent decisions based on the geographical, legal, and emotional issues that will be unknown until you die.

In addition, our Gun Trusts can be setup to last from generation to generation while providing asset protect for your firearms. Yes it is possible to protect your firearms from creditors, divorce, divorce of a child or grandchild, and even from the creditors of your descendants.

Any new requirements will likely slow down the process of obtaining approval from the ATF and may make the new electronic filing that the ATF introduced obsolete. If you are thinking of getting a gun trust to purchase a Title II firearm, now may be the time to do so before new regulations are enacted which change the way they work.

As we have not seen any of the proposal and once it is published there will be a 90 day comment period prior to the introduction of any changes, it is hard to speculate on how or what may be changed.

We do not think this will significantly make a difference to our typical gun trust client as we do not provide gun trusts to felons, domestic abuser, or other prohibited persons. In fact, our trust would not be valid if used by a prohibited person.

Our Gun Trusts are created so that if the law changes we can address the changes in law by changing the trust. It is likely that most if not all changes can or will be addressed as they are made known.

August 29, 2013

Gun owners with Trusts or Corporations and Obama Administration

Today there has been much news about an action or executive order to help ensure that people who should not be able to own NFA firearms are not permitted to do so using a Trust.

First, our Gun Trusts, have never allowed a prohibited person to legally purchase, or be authorized to use firearms or ammunition. This is one of the significant differences between a real Gun Trust from a Gun Trust Lawyer® like we provide, and other so called gun trusts or regular estate planning Trusts.

If you are a criminal, addicted to drugs, a user of illegal drugs(under federal law including medical marijuana), or prohibited to own firearms under local, state, or federal laws, you cannot use our documents to create a valid trust. In addition, any co-trustee or authorized users who are prohibited cannot be added and any attempt to do so is void.

In regards to what is being reported in the news today, at this time we have not seen anything in writing to indicate what was done, what will change, or how it or when any changes will be implemented. At this time, some reports indicate they are proposed changes that will go through a 90 day review at ATF, prior to ATF making any decision to implement any changes. Once we have seen the documents we will be in a position to comment.

The Prince Law Firm has a good article on the ATF Rulemaking Process and potential implications for Gun Trusts.

If you want to keep up to date on any changes or updates to this issue, you should watch this blog or subscribe to it by using the subscribe function in the upper right under the state map or clicking on the subscribe image below.
subscribe.jpg

Last Updated 8/29

August 16, 2013

Gun Trust and Submitting ATF Forms online

Yesterday, I decided to try out the ATFonline.gov Eforms submission. I found the process very easy to do and while a little confusing the first time, it seems rather intuitive. Below are the steps I followed:


  1. Register for an account at ATFonline.gov. The system is very picky and must be used with IE 8 or a recent version of Safari on OS X. Sorry no Firefox, Chrome, or even IE 7.
  2. Log in.
  3. Select the Form 1. Better to use the bar and move it with the mouse, it is very difficult to scroll through the forms. ATF needs to switch this to a drop down menu.
  4. Application - this is where you state whether you are tax exempt or will be paying a tax.
  5. Applicant - Select that you are not a FFL and then complete your information. You should list the Trust name as the Licensee / Permitee Name.applicant.jpg
  6. Add line items. You can use one application for multiple items. I choose to only do one SBR. It walked me through the process of selecting the manufacture from a list.line-item.jpg
  7. Upload electronic documents. This is where I uploaded my scanned Gun Trust Documents.upload.jpg
  8. Certify that Under Penalties of Perjury, I Declare that I have examined this application, including accompanying documents, and to the best of my knowledge and belief it is true, accurate and complete and the making and possession of the firearm described above would not constitute a violation of Chapter 44, Title 18, U.S.C., Chapter 53, Title 26, U.S.C., or any provisions of State or local law.
  9. Enter credit card payment information
  10. Sign and Submit. By clicking a check box, your application will be submitted.

Within a few minutes I received a confirmation email showing that I had submitted my application and it was Pending Research because the manufacture I had selected was not listed in their database. This morning I received a new update saying that my status was changed to Submitted/In Process. I will keep updating this blog as I receive more information but it already feels faster than the paper system.

It was interesting to see that there was no certification of citizenship that was required my many ATF agents in the past. We had always taken the position that a Trust is not a person and as such cannot have a citizenship. If you are submitting the paper forms, we still recommend submitting the Certification, in case you agent wants it. For instructions see http://www.GunTrustLawyer.com/certification.html.

ATF Online submission of Form 1 Status Updates.


  • Thursday August 8, 2013 Electronic Form 1 Submitted to ATF online
  • Friday August 9, 2013 Status changed to Submitted/In Process
    (with paper it will take 1-2 months and as much as 6 months to cash your check and change the status to In Process